Skip to content What We Tell Guests BEFORE They Sit at the Table… | S4E34 BEYOND THE LETTER PODCAST Jun 3 · 59 min ...more
What We Tell Guests BEFORE They Sit at the Table… | S4E34 BEYOND THE LETTER PODCAST
June 3, 2026 · 59 min
In this solo episode, Adam sits down for an open Q&A and takes you behind the scenes of how Beyond the Letter actually works. From how guests are prepared before the cameras roll, to how conversations stay honest without turning chaotic, this is one of those episodes that feels like you’re getting the unfiltered “how it’s really done.”Adam also answers a mix of practical and real-life questions around hosting, communication, leadership, and the moments that unexpectedly go viral. If you’ve ever wondered what happens before an episode starts (and what we’re trying to avoid), this one pulls the curtain back while keeping the focus where it belongs: helping people grow in everyday faith and everyday life.--Connect with:Adam Mesa https://www.instagram.com/amesa/--Don't forget to stay connected with us:Youtube https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC4OvpFp9OB9_DgVdVVbXhFgInstagram https://www.instagram.com/beyond.theletter/Tik Tok https://www.tiktok.com/discover/beyond-the-letter--Have a question? Submit it TODAY, by clicking the link below! ***SUBMIT YOUR QUESTION HERE: https://patria.church.ai/form/BeyondtheLetterQA--Get to know the team:@amesa https://www.instagram.com/amesa/@nancysnavas https://www.instagram.com/nancysnavas/@alizee.kayy https://www.instagram.com/alizee.kayy/@andytakesl https://www.instagram.com/andytakesl/
Series Beyond the Letter Article · 8 min read Pastor Adam Mesa on Leadership, Social Media and Church In a quick-fire send-off before a summer break, Pastor Adam Mesa talks about leading staff, young pastors online, politics in church and why leadership looks like caring. June 3, 2026 · 59 min · Beyond the Letter
In this solo episode, Adam sits down for an open Q&A and takes you behind the scenes of how Beyond the Letter actually works. From how guests are prepared before the cameras roll, to how conversations stay honest without turning chaotic, this is one of those episodes that feels like you’re getting the unfiltered “how it’s really done.”Adam also answers a mix of practical and real-life questions around hosting, communication, leadership, and the moments that unexpectedly go viral. If you’ve ever wondered what happens before an episode starts (and what we’re trying to avoid), this one pulls the curtain back while keeping the focus where it belongs: helping people grow in everyday faith and everyday life.--Connect with:Adam Mesa https://www.instagram.com/amesa/--Don't forget to stay connected with us:Youtube https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC4OvpFp9OB9_DgVdVVbXhFgInstagram https://www.instagram.com/beyond.theletter/Tik Tok https://www.tiktok.com/discover/beyond-the-letter--Have a question? Submit it TODAY, by clicking the link below! ***SUBMIT YOUR QUESTION HERE: https://patria.church.ai/form/BeyondtheLetterQA--Get to know the team:@amesa https://www.instagram.com/amesa/@nancysnavas https://www.instagram.com/nancysnavas/@alizee.kayy https://www.instagram.com/alizee.kayy/@andytakesl https://www.instagram.com/andytakesl/ ...more Show the full description Show less In this solo episode, Adam sits down for an open Q&A and takes you behind the scenes of how Beyond the Letter actually works. From how guests are prepared before the cameras roll, to how conversations stay honest without turning chaotic, this is one of those episodes that feels like you’re getting the unfiltered “how it’s really done.”Adam also answers a mix of practical and real-life questions around hosting, communication, leadership, and the moments that unexpectedly go viral. If you’ve ever wondered what happens before an episode starts (and what we’re trying to avoid), this one pulls the curtain back while keeping the focus where it belongs: helping people grow in everyday faith and everyday life.--Connect with:Adam Mesa https://www.instagram.com/amesa/--Don't forget to stay connected with us:Youtube https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC4OvpFp9OB9_DgVdVVbXhFgInstagram https://www.instagram.com/beyond.theletter/Tik Tok https://www.tiktok.com/discover/beyond-the-letter--Have a question? Submit it TODAY, by clicking the link below! ***SUBMIT YOUR QUESTION HERE: https://patria.church.ai/form/BeyondtheLetterQA--Get to know the team:@amesa https://www.instagram.com/amesa/@nancysnavas https://www.instagram.com/nancysnavas/@alizee.kayy https://www.instagram.com/alizee.kayy/@andytakesl https://www.instagram.com/andytakesl/
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Adam Mesa is Lead Pastor of Patria Church and speaks to a congregation of 12,000 about how the gospel of Jesus Christ brings purpose to every life. Patria
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0:00 When we have a guest that we know they're sharing ideas that might be controversial, we tell them ahead of time now, hey. Have you ever been viral before? And if they say no, then we actually have conversations with0:10 them. Hey. Come in on our show. If you go viral, here's some advice that we recommend. And we actually prescribe steps that they should take if they go viral to protect their mental health. All0:25 right. We rocking right, Andy?0:27 We are.0:28 All right. What's up, everybody? Welcome to Beyond the Letter. Thanks for joining us today. I'm sitting on the opposite side because as you guys know, we're taking a little summer break. We're upgrading some of the0:39 technology, doing some refurbishments, to some of the space here. And so, team's already testing a few of the cameras that came in, but we got a lot of other tech that's coming in. And0:51 so, there's a lot of renovation to do over the next month. And so as you guys know, this is probably the last episode for the summer, not all summer. We'll be back once we get everything installed. And1:02 so, you know, as I'm sitting on this side because, we started moving some things around, the other camera angles weren't working good. And so now for the first time, I don't think I've ever... Have I ever saw something1:14 on this side? No. I've never had I've never had the beyond the letter logo behind me for a lot of... Majority of our listeners are listeners. Yeah. So1:23 You are the logo.1:25 It's crazy that we do this much work for all the video when, I think ninety percent of the, like, the podcasters are listeners and not video watchers.
1:34 But
1:34 but it gets the clips. So, you know, it also lets us get all of the social media clips, which help us with exposure for the podcast. But I always think about that. I'm always like, man, we'd be doing so much work for the
1:45 video when majority... Because the audio, that can't really... Our audio can't really be upgraded all that much. So, you know, we have great microphones and all that stuff. And I think, Andy, do you
1:57 use AI to clean up the audio on the back end at all?
1:59 Every now and then. If we have, like, a
2:01 band Okay. Every now and then. Yes. So, I mean, audio is always pretty good. The only best... Better things we could do is, like, completely sound treat this room, which just wouldn't be
2:12 practical. So... But we are redoing a lot of the video. So as you guys know, this is the last episode going into a little bit of a break so that we can upgrade all of our technology. And
2:24 is pretty much gonna be me today for this last episode. And as we are going into this episode, going into our little bit of a summer break, we thought that, you know, Nancy has looked through a
2:36 bunch of kind of quick fire questions, stuff that deals with, I think, faith and church and a bunch of other things in between culture and life. And so I thought maybe we would do just kind
2:48 of like a quick fire. Haven't really... I definitely haven't put any thought to any of these questions she's gonna ask. She went through them. I've only seen, like, one or two. And so, ultimately, I don't know the
2:58 answers to this. I don't know what I'm gonna say. I don't know what Nancy has chosen. You know? But in the room, we got Nancy with us. We got Alize with us. We got Andy. We got Phil somewhere around the corner in
3:10 his normal spot. And so go ahead, Nancy. What what what what is gonna be the first kind of quick fire, fast fire question for today?
3:20 Okay. The first one we're gonna start with because I'm personally just curious what you think. I'm being selfish. Okay. Uh-oh. So if social media disappeared tomorrow, how would
3:32 ministry change?
3:34 Okay.
3:34 If social media disappeared tomorrow
3:37 Yeah.
3:38 How would ministry change?
3:42 I mean, you know, I've been relatively in ministry long enough that I remember how it was before social media. And a lot of the things were... And in
3:53 some ways, you see some of it going back to it, but, I mean, it it would change a lot because a lot of a lot of word-of-mouth, a lot of people that come and visit the church or even, like, say, with our
4:05 podcast Mhmm. There's individuals that have been podcasting since before social media was around. And so it was very much you send it to a friend through email, word-of-mouth. It wasn't something that was
4:17 just posted. But, you know, ninety percent of our exposures nowadays, even for business, I I I just met with someone who's opening up a business, and they started getting
4:29 some, like, coaching from, like, a really other successful company. Mhmm. And they said, like, fifty percent of their new business plan has to have social media in mind. Like, what kind of posts are you gonna do? Wow.
4:40 Like, who are you gonna hire to represent the business, you know, as people come in and post their experience and all that kind of stuff like that? And so that's a reality of of today. So if that was removed
4:51 today, ministry would be way more analog than it is. Yeah. You you know, if you didn't have social media, you would basically... It's much
5:03 more driven by, hey. You have to come and experience it and kinda see it and experience it.
5:09 Mhmm.
5:09 And so you're heavily rely on that word-of-mouth, people inviting people. And so I I remember those days. I've been in ministry long enough. It was... You know, my dad was the pastor in those days. It was... I felt like
5:20 every Sunday was like, hey. Tell your friend we have this going on. And they were kinda like, almost like sound bites that you could tell your friend. Hey. Next week, we're gonna be talking about, you know, how to
5:32 deal with x y and z. Go tell your friend. Yeah. Because there was no way you could broadcast it as a church. So you you relied heavily on on a person sending a text message, making a phone call. So social media didn't
5:43 exist today. You couldn't just, like... Because nowadays, we don't Even though majority of people go and visit churches based off word-of-mouth, but people double check first by going on Instagram and YouTube and all
5:55 that stuff. So if you remove that today, you would basically have the process where people would have to go and experience it on their own, which, I mean, it's not a it's not a bad thing to
6:04 Right.
6:05 To revert to that.
6:06 Right.
6:07 You know?
6:08 That's a good answer. Do you think print will increase? I feel like we still do
6:11 print social media. Yeah. Oh, for sure. Print would... Yeah.
6:14 You would have All the
6:15 newsletters and the newsletters and LA Times at your which that would be pretty innovative stuff that like, you know, that might even work now without, you know, sending newspapers
6:27 to people's houses that talk about what you have going on and stuff like that. Yeah.
6:32 Right. Okay. This next one, I had it right here. So it was about leadership. Is it harder to prepare for sermons or to lead staff? So
6:44 is it harder to preach Yeah. Or is it harder to lead staff?
6:48 Yeah. It's way harder to lead staff than it is to preach. I guess it comes down to, like, what your git mix is, but, you know, eighty percent of
7:00 what a pastor does is leadership related, and it and it has to do with volunteers, discipleship. You know, what what we do is only, you
7:11 know, between preaching and studying. So, like, I would say weekly studying, I'm probably, like, maybe ten to fifteen hours a week of study. Mhmm. You add in being on the stage and presenting probably
7:23 another, you know, five hours of actual preaching. Right? Right. Not after praying with people, talking with people. Right. So you probably had twenty hours of the... Of, like, preaching, at least on my
7:35 side of things. That's preaching. But I probably work, I don't know, sixty to sixty five hours a week. And so about forty hours to forty five hours is just people related things,
7:46 counseling, employment things, leadership things, leadership meetings, different groups meeting with different people in your church and spending time with them. And so it's way harder
7:58 to do that because now you inject everybody's personalities, everybody's desires, everybody's needs, wants, all that stuff. It's... It really wouldn't even compare. Now the the the weight. Mhmm.
8:10 Ten times preaching carries more of a weight. You
8:13 know? Okay.
8:14 Like, there's been times, and it happens often, like, before I go on stage and deliver a message, I'm, you know, depressed or I get off, and I I feel spiritually depleted. And Yeah. It's just like, it's almost as if
8:26 you went and ran a ten k, you know, race.
8:29 Yeah.
8:29 You're just you're just exhausted. Yeah. When it comes to leading people, like, I've never really been like Mhmm. Even I've been in tough meetings and tough rooms. I've never I've never been like, oh my goodness. That
8:39 that would... I've been in wait... Maybe a couple times, but pretty regularly Mhmm. I'm either gonna go up to preach or I'm done preaching. I go, wow. There's some people really going on with some things in that room.
8:50 Like, you can, you know
8:52 Feel that confidence.
8:53 Preaching sermons is one of the... You know, it's been said by pastors before. It's one of the rarest things where not only are you delivering a message, but you feel the weight Mhmm. Of the room Mhmm. Because it's a
9:03 spiritual... It's not only a mental endeavor, but it's a spiritual endeavor. And so, you know, you have some people that are going through, you know, terminal illnesses. You have other people that are going through loss
9:14 of jobs. You have other people that are going through demonic warfare. Other people are going through affairs, divorces.
9:21 Right.
9:21 And you go up there and especially if you're talking about something that, like, hits those areas Yeah. Sexuality, whatever Mhmm. Immediately, you just... You feel that weight. Mhmm.
9:33 And you're just like, oh, there were some people in that room that did not want that message.
9:38 You know?
9:39 Like, you you feel it. Yeah. That's And then there's other times that you're... I mean, just not too long ago, I, you know, touched on some things on politics. And the moment I said it, a woman in the third row gets up,
9:51 just scorns at me, does the sign of the cross, kneels on the side because we get a lot of Catholics nowadays. So she kneels outside the aisle like you're supposed to do every time you get up and leave, and she does the
10:01 sign of the cross and just angrily stares at me in the middle of the message and just storms out. Wow. That doesn't happen too much when you're, like, leading people. Not not too many times people
10:13 storm out because of you. They may storm out. Like, I've done marriage counseling. Someone stormed out, but it... It's not about me. There's there's marriage tension or... Like, there's... Preaching is that moment. Like,
10:24 people get up and leave your sermons. You know? Last year, we had a woman stand up who was Oh, yeah. You know, mentally not doing well, and she started screaming at me that I had cameras in her car.
10:35 In the middle of you preaching.
10:37 Yeah. That I had cameras in her car and, you know, I was following her and this and that, and and everybody was like, wow. This is this is crazy. And and they obvious... Obviously, everybody
10:49 wrote her off, but there were probably, you know, three thousand people in the room. And so everybody just turned, and she's in a far back aisle. And it's like, you know, it's stuff like that. You walk away. And in that
11:00 moment, I just said, I hear you talk to me after service. I'd love to understand more where you're coming from.
11:04 Yeah.
11:05 And she just kept going and going and, you know, clearly wasn't well.
11:09 Right.
11:09 And, you know, the team the team walked her out, but you... Like, you know, that sits with you. And then a month later, she's like, do you remember me? I'm like, no. She's like, I'm the woman who stood up. You know? And
11:19 I'm like, oh, okay. Hello. And she's like, I'm sorry about that. I was going through a bad day. I'm like Oh. But you think? Right.
11:26 In front of so many people.
11:27 But you go home and you're like, what... You know, could I have dealt with it differently? And so preaching has a more of a weight. Mhmm. But it wouldn't... It... It's not harder Okay. In that sense. Like, it's harder to
11:38 lead people.
11:39 Yeah. So if if they presented you, like, if they said, hey. We have the top person that can lead people and you can solely focus on preaching. Or if they said, hey. We
11:51 have somebody that can handle preaching, but I feel like that wouldn't happen because you would be preaching most of the time. But would you choose between one or the other?
11:58 No. I don't think you can. I mean, I would... I... Well, you know, I love preaching, but, yeah, I don't think you can choose one or the other. I I think you I think you have to do both in order to do them well. Yeah.
12:11 I I do know some churches where that pastor is a teaching pastor, his sole responsibility is
12:15 Oh, wow.
12:16 Study for sermons, and that's it. That's it. He doesn't go to, you know, he doesn't go to any, like, budget meetings, leadership meetings, staff meetings, like, probably attend staff meetings, but, like, he's not leading
12:27 in any of that way. Mhmm. And I just feel like, you know, I I couldn't do it. You know? I I like having... I'm not able to do as... Some of the things as much as I I
12:39 would like to, but it's like... I I like getting... Doing counseling sessions. I like being in the rooms with people because it gives me a temperature of where people are at. Yeah. And
12:49 So do you think, like, in the future you would do that? Like, a traveling speaker?
12:53 No. I don't like that.
12:54 Oh, no. No. Okay. Yeah.
12:56 Yeah. Yeah. I don't like being away from the family.
12:59 Yeah. And then doing all that. Like, usually, you see, okay. Once they retire, now they're traveler speakers.
13:04 You know? Yeah. Maybe I would do that older, but I don't... I've done it before. I don't enjoy it. Yeah. It's lot. And all that stuff. It's not it's not fun. For a lot of pastors, it's their dream to be, like...
13:16 To be such a great preacher and be invited and and... You know, I I probably get invited to preach maybe thirty times a year.
13:23 Mhmm.
13:23 And I... Last year, I think I said yes to four.
13:26 Mhmm.
13:26 And so it... It's not as much as I love preaching, it's it's it's too much. You know? It it... I like to be at church. I like to be
13:35 Involved with
13:37 Yeah. Involved with what's going on here at our church as much as possible. You know?
13:42 That makes sense. That's good.
13:43 I I prefer more business things than I do ministry because I feel like there's a lot of pastors who preach, and you could have a lot. Yeah. But I feel like there's not a lot of, you know, pastors that speak into career
13:53 spaces.
13:54 Oh, yeah.
13:54 You know, and minister from that place.
13:56 Right.
13:56 And and I and I like going into places as as pastor Adam who also has a specialty in, you know, technology and marketing on that. And then I infuse my faith, and I just feel I
14:08 get to reach people that, you know, they they they they carry influence and, you know, I can make a bigger impact
14:16 Mhmm.
14:16 So to say for the gospel than than a room that everybody chose to be there on Sunday. But Right. Being able to be asked by a company where, you know, a hundred of them aren't Christians, but they want me to talk, and I
14:27 can... And they're fine. You... Me kinda embedding my faith
14:31 Right.
14:31 Into what I'm doing. It's like, that's what I... I I enjoy all of it. It's all great, but I really like that because I get a I get a... I like reaching people that are really far from God. Yeah. To me, I get encouraged
14:42 when someone says, I never went to church or had a relation with Jesus. And, you know, because of this message or because of this podcast, I started going to church for the first time. I'm like, well, that... I I prefer
14:52 that. Then them coming up to me and saying, hey. You preached the best message I've ever heard in my life.
14:56 Right.
14:56 I... I'm flattered by that, but I'm way more flower... Flattered by, hey. You just said this one statement. I never went to church, and I live in Arizona, and I started going to church. I'm like, oh, that's that's a win
15:07 for the essence of what beyond the letter is.
15:10 Exactly. Yeah. Yeah.
15:11 And and that's funny because I literally... It's been, I don't know, five years since I worked at Monster, and I recently had somebody who used to work there with me. And she had reached out throughout the years. I sent
15:21 her the podcast, and she just recently met with pastor Kenny for a counseling session. Yeah. And she started through listening to Beyond the Letter, but she's not a Christian. Her boyfriend, I think, gets like a
15:32 hardcore, like, metal band guitarist or something like that.
15:35 Wow.
15:36 And so it was through Beyond the Letter that she... Now she's, like, here meeting with pastor Kenny.
15:40 Well, Ashley was just at the gym recently, and someone that doesn't go to church was like, I listen to your guys' stuff every week. I love it. And, yeah, it's it's... To me, I'm I'm way more like, oh, that's a win.
15:52 I get to be Yeah. At my church. I don't have to be traveling. I mean, beyond the letter or nothing else doesn't bring additional income to me or whatever it grows our ministry. But Mhmm. You know, sometimes pastors go,
16:04 oh, I like to travel and preach because it brings additional income Right. Into their home. But for me, it's not about that. Right. So to say, I... You know, I I understand why they have to do it, but Right. That's not
16:15 what drives me.
16:16 Right.
16:16 I I I made a living out in the, you know, secular world before so I know how to do that apart from ministry and so, you know, that's far less important to me than Yeah. Than stuff like this.
16:27 Yeah. And we can see it's genuine. Okay. Let's see this kinda like a doubleheader but question is, one thing younger pastors need to stop doing. One thing younger pastors
16:38 younger pastors
16:40 need to stop doing. To stop doing. Yeah.
16:44 Oh, man. That's a good question. I... Here, I would say this. I would I would frame it a little bit. One thing young pastors and probably young believers should stop doing
16:55 is being... And this goes back to kind of our social media. The first question
16:59 is Oh, yeah.
17:00 Don't be so quick to broadcast your life
17:04 Mhmm.
17:05 And your thoughts and your opinions on everything. Like, there... We live in an age right now that it's like the the moment you, you know, develop a new personality type.
17:15 Yeah.
17:15 It's like throw it online. You know? Show it to everybody. And, and I say that not because they don't have any value... Anything valuable to share. Mhmm. They do. It's just because
17:28 their mental health isn't developed enough to handle the criticisms that come Mhmm. With broadcasting your life. And so and so my warning to to a young believer, young pastor who's
17:40 who who who... My advice to them of, hey. Don't broadcast everything right away. It's really not coming from a place of because you have no value to add. You have nothing to say. You you have value to say. Yeah.
17:52 You know? If if you had an encounter with Jesus, that that is no matter how big or small that is, that's valuable. Yeah. But they go above and beyond, and I think we see that. We did an episode on it. You see it
18:04 with that person, Neza Powers, you know, the the person that was detransitioning, and then now they're transitioning back and and immediately just within thirty days. And we even talked about it, and then
18:15 almost a year went detransitioning. And then now is is say, oh, I didn't mean any of that. Mhmm. And everybody's kinda wrestling with, and they're and they're going hard on him because they're like, hey. You broadcasted
18:27 your life. You you opened up the door for us. Now we feel we have a right to criticize, to correct, to this and that. And I do think to a degree, they they they
18:37 That's fair to say.
18:38 He... If he's still putting it online, he... They do have a right. He he can he can close his account tomorrow. Right. And so, you know, a lot of people nowadays, they just go, hey. I got this new personality.
18:50 I'm a start throwing it online. Mhmm. I I think I think young pastors, young Christians, like like gestation period. Just spend some time getting a mentor
19:00 Mhmm.
19:01 Getting a mother figure, a father figure.
19:03 Yeah.
19:03 You know, like, Right. Grind, serve. You know?
19:08 You could still document it, but maybe use it for the future or something not necessarily post it.
19:13 Yeah. Use it for the future or document it where you're not... You know, a lot of times it's documented and then like like like, let me tell you how you're all doing this wrong or let me tell you how this needs to be
19:23 corrected. And it's just
19:24 like point.
19:25 Yeah. Yeah. It's more critical, and I figured it out. And and that's what opens up to all the criticism.
19:31 Mhmm.
19:31 And and I don't mind it. They're not... Most of the time, they're not saying anything wrong. Mhmm. It's just they don't hand... They... To start doing stuff online, you have to have such a developed mental health
19:43 Mhmm.
19:43 That people just don't consciously they don't consciously work on. Yeah. And so they just think that because it's behind a computer or behind a phone that it
19:55 doesn't... It won't affect them and it doesn't exist. And unfortunately, it's not true. Yeah. And I and I know a lot of, you know, influencers and people that, you know, make their living off social
20:07 media. And, man, they they go to therapy. They got... They're anxious. They're depressed. They're... You know, it's like... And it's being funnel... Fueled by social media. Yeah. And so my thing is it... When you feel
20:18 you're gonna start broadcasting your life on social media, not just not just showing people a day in the life on how you're cooking and cleaning or whatever. Like, that's not a big deal. It's like you're starting to form
20:28 opinions. You're starting to make opinions. Maybe on the letter and beyond, I do... We do that. You know? Like, we form opinions. We share our opinions. Mhmm. We've been doing this for four years.
20:37 Mhmm.
20:37 And those first... That first year was like... It... Like, now for us, when we have guests Yeah. We tell them, hey. You know, like, our team and, you know, Andy and the rest of the team, we've
20:49 we've we've kinda somewhat figured out
20:52 Mhmm.
20:52 When we want to. It's not regular. But when we want to, if we want something to get a lot of exposure and go viral, like, we have an awareness on on how to cut it. Yeah. And when we have a guest that we know they're
21:02 sharing ideas that might be controversial, we tell them ahead of time now, hey. Have you... We ask them, have you ever been viral before? And if they say no, then we actually have conversations with them. Hey, come in on
21:14 our show. If you go viral, here's some advice that we recommend. And we actually prescribe
21:19 Yeah.
21:20 Steps that they should take if they go viral to protect their mental health.
21:24 Mhmm.
21:24 And most of the time, they're like, oh, you know, they just brush it. Oh, it won't affect me, and I'm strong. And, you know, they... And then they go viral at times. And Mhmm. You know, Will Chung was famous for that.
21:35 Will Chung said, I was afraid of council culture until I came on beyond the letter, you know, three years ago.
21:41 Mhmm.
21:41 And he said beyond the letter taught me how to have mental mental strength.
21:47 Resilience. Yeah.
21:48 Resilience. He said he didn't have that before to the degree. He said, but beyond the letter taught him that actually people can't... That... You know? Yeah. I mean, people can't hurt you. But it... Like, you know, if
21:59 you just look at the comments. Right? He's like, people can't hurt you. People can't offend you. If you just... He was always scared of people's opinions. I mean, so was I. So am I.
22:07 Think everybody deals with that. Yeah.Show more
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