Skip to content Testing Truth with Scripture | S3E51 BEYOND THE LETTER PODCAST Sep 29 · 55 min ...more
Testing Truth with Scripture | S3E51 BEYOND THE LETTER PODCAST
September 29, 2025 · 55 min
In this episode of Beyond the Letter, Adam addresses the growing trend of viral videos and popular teachings that misrepresent the Bible. Many ideas sound spiritual but don’t stand on the foundation of Scripture.Adam challenges us to dig deeper than surface-level faith, reminding us that God’s Word is the ultimate standard of truth. Using examples from Exodus and beyond, he shows how misinterpretations can lead us astray—and how rightly dividing Scripture keeps us rooted in God’s design. This conversation is a call to believers everywhere: don’t just accept what sounds good, study God’s Word for yourself. Only then can we stand firm, refute falsehood, and walk in truth.--Connect with:Pastor Adam Mesa https://www.instagram.com/amesa/--Don't forget to stay connected with us:Youtube https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC4OvpFp9OB9_DgVdVVbXhFgInstagram https://www.instagram.com/beyond.theletter/Tik Tok https://www.tiktok.com/discover/beyond-the-letter--Get Aaron Levy's book, JOHN: 21 Daily Drips of Dialogue: https://a.co/d/7lGB90i--Have a question? Submit it TODAY, by clicking the link below! ***SUBMIT YOUR QUESTION HERE: https://patria.church.ai/form/BeyondtheLetterQA--Get to know the team:@amesa https://www.instagram.com/amesa/@verlonbakerofficial https://www.instagram.com/verlonbakerofficial/@nancysnavas https://www.instagram.com/nancysnavas/@alizee.kayy https://www.instagram.com/alizee.kayy/@andytakesl https://www.instagram.com/andytakesl/
Series Beyond the Letter
Adam Mesa is Lead Pastor of Patria Church and speaks to a congregation of 12,000 about how the gospel of Jesus Christ brings purpose to every life. Patria
September 29, 2025 · 55 min · Beyond the Letter
In this episode of Beyond the Letter, Adam addresses the growing trend of viral videos and popular teachings that misrepresent the Bible. Many ideas sound spiritual but don’t stand on the foundation of Scripture.Adam challenges us to dig deeper than surface-level faith, reminding us that God’s Word is the ultimate standard of truth. Using examples from Exodus and beyond, he shows how misinterpretations can lead us astray—and how rightly dividing Scripture keeps us rooted in God’s design. This conversation is a call to believers everywhere: don’t just accept what sounds good, study God’s Word for yourself. Only then can we stand firm, refute falsehood, and walk in truth.--Connect with:Pastor Adam Mesa https://www.instagram.com/amesa/--Don't forget to stay connected with us:Youtube https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC4OvpFp9OB9_DgVdVVbXhFgInstagram https://www.instagram.com/beyond.theletter/Tik Tok https://www.tiktok.com/discover/beyond-the-letter--Get Aaron Levy's book, JOHN: 21 Daily Drips of Dialogue: https://a.co/d/7lGB90i--Have a question? Submit it TODAY, by clicking the link below! ***SUBMIT YOUR QUESTION HERE: https://patria.church.ai/form/BeyondtheLetterQA--Get to know the team:@amesa https://www.instagram.com/amesa/@verlonbakerofficial https://www.instagram.com/verlonbakerofficial/@nancysnavas https://www.instagram.com/nancysnavas/@alizee.kayy https://www.instagram.com/alizee.kayy/@andytakesl https://www.instagram.com/andytakesl/ ...more Show the full description Show less In this episode of Beyond the Letter, Adam addresses the growing trend of viral videos and popular teachings that misrepresent the Bible. Many ideas sound spiritual but don’t stand on the foundation of Scripture.Adam challenges us to dig deeper than surface-level faith, reminding us that God’s Word is the ultimate standard of truth. Using examples from Exodus and beyond, he shows how misinterpretations can lead us astray—and how rightly dividing Scripture keeps us rooted in God’s design. This conversation is a call to believers everywhere: don’t just accept what sounds good, study God’s Word for yourself. Only then can we stand firm, refute falsehood, and walk in truth.--Connect with:Pastor Adam Mesa https://www.instagram.com/amesa/--Don't forget to stay connected with us:Youtube https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC4OvpFp9OB9_DgVdVVbXhFgInstagram https://www.instagram.com/beyond.theletter/Tik Tok https://www.tiktok.com/discover/beyond-the-letter--Get Aaron Levy's book, JOHN: 21 Daily Drips of Dialogue: https://a.co/d/7lGB90i--Have a question? Submit it TODAY, by clicking the link below! ***SUBMIT YOUR QUESTION HERE: https://patria.church.ai/form/BeyondtheLetterQA--Get to know the team:@amesa https://www.instagram.com/amesa/@verlonbakerofficial https://www.instagram.com/verlonbakerofficial/@nancysnavas https://www.instagram.com/nancysnavas/@alizee.kayy https://www.instagram.com/alizee.kayy/@andytakesl https://www.instagram.com/andytakesl/
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0:04 It's a solo episode, so it's not like I'll get to drink much of my coffee during this episode. It'd be awkward someone driving and then there's just silence0:13 and just taking a sip, you know, my own sip. Sip break. Yeah. Little oh, let me just take you know, we got like, if we we have a rule well, not well, not0:25 we. I have a rule that were you at our communications thing that we did, Nancy? Like, when I did it with with the staff last year, the some of the pastors on, like, preaching, teaching, all that stuff like that? And I0:36 told them, and I was like, okay. Well, this isn't necessarily a rule, but it's my rule. If if you're preaching or you're teaching from a stage and I see you pause to take a drink of water0:47 Oh my gosh.0:48 I'm a get so mad, and you need to show up hydrated. That's what you need to do.0:54 Can't. Yeah. Cough or0:56 something, and it's like, okay. Yeah. And, again, it's the transition. I told them. I was like I was like, listen. If you need if you need a if you need a drink of water, here's what you do. You say, you grab the water,1:08 you prepare it, you finish your thought, and then you say, tell your neighbor, and you repeat whatever you just said. So it gives them a moment. They say something. Boom. Take a quick drink. Set it down. But a lot of1:19 times with communicators, they'll be like, you know, and God parted the Red Sea. And that's what I'm here to tell you. You know? And you're like Yeah. I've seen some1:30 take multiple drinks. I'm like, you're not coughing. Like,
1:34 your throat seems fine. Yeah. You can't be that thirsty. You're not dying.
1:38 In 40 minutes, you can't pause?
1:40 Exactly. So they know it was like and it was like no 1, like, no 1 had heard it from me before. So that when I do that when I did that communicate, I'm like, now this might be news to some of you guys, but it just grinds
1:50 my gears if you take a drink of water after you say a point. Like, I just because the world we live in, we live in a social media world. Like, the moment you disconnect people, man, phone, you know, like, they're they're
2:02 grabbing their phone. They're checking that text message, whatever. So I was like, hey. I get it. You you if you're talking, you may get thirsty. But, you know, if you're if you know you drink, then have it open, have it
2:13 ready, you know, like and then
2:15 Have you always been that way or you saw somebody that was doing this so many times you're like, mental note, don't do what this guy did.
2:23 No. Well, I mean, I took, you know, in I went to bible school. So we you take you take preaching and teaching and communication and all that stuff like that. You take stage presence and all that. It's like a version of
2:33 it. It's just different versions called homiletics, all that stuff like that. So you learn. Like, you learn you learn about voice inflection. You you learn about, you know, when when
2:45 to lower your voice. You know, you learn how, you know, show up knowing how to pronounce a word that you're gonna pronounce, you know, like, you know, learning
2:55 teach you, like, wardrobe? Like, what to wear, what
2:57 Not really. I mean, some depending on what bible school you're at, they might have their own customs. So, like, where I was at at Masters, like, suit and tie only. Like, you can't wear anything but that. So so if you
3:09 were gonna present that day, you had to have a suit and tie on and stuff like that. So every that's more of a cultural thing for sure. Definitely present yourself, though. Like, I am big on that. Yeah. Yeah. But I think
3:20 that there's, like, degrees to presenting yourself. But on stage, it it tend to me, it should be, like, kind of business casual and above Yeah. For the most part. But, like, some churches, they actually have, like, a
3:31 booklet of, like, what's approved and what's not. Like, some truths don't some churches don't allow denim to be worn on presenting. And more so it's about like professionalism, presentation. It's not like a religious
3:42 thing Right. Or anything like that. Some are religious for sure. Some are like you ever heard those viral preachers like, you know, these pastors wearing their jeans. They don't love Jesus.
3:52 Yeah. It's like
3:52 because they got jeans on. These girls, they're wearing pants. Can you believe that?
3:56 I know it's a church.
3:57 I'm like, what are they talking about? Right. They get pants. Like, what are you what are we even saying right now? What's up, everybody? Welcome to Beyond the Letter. Thanks for joining us today.
4:09 Hope you've been doing well. Thank you for being a part of the community. As always, we appreciate you so much subscribing, leaving great reviews, sharing this with people. It's always amazing to hear when
4:20 people, interact with our podcast, man. I I I'll be in other states, other cities, and, people will know, who we are because of beyond the letter. And so it's
4:32 always always an honor that someone would listen to us, even an episode for a or for a moment. And, today will be somewhat of a shorter episode than our than our normal beyond the letters because
4:45 it's me. It's a solo episode. Every once in a while, we've always gotten great feedback from the solo episodes. It's an opportunity where I could take certain thoughts, ideas, and I'll just I'll just I'll just rant them
4:56 to you, and we'll talk about some things. And so I do have some things prepared that we can look at, kind of an overall topic and theme that we can discuss today. I think it's I think it's
5:07 appropriate for the day and age we live in today specifically, but also in the topic of conversation that we're going to talk about. And so however long this episode is,
5:19 whether you're driving with us, watching this on on YouTube, we appreciate you taking part. I thought what would be good is I think a lot of times conceptually, we'll
5:31 have conversations with individuals and people and some will make a statement about God. They'll make a statement about the Bible. They'll make a statement about Christianity. And
5:43 we, you know, get nervous that it's like something you've never heard before. So therefore, you kind of you end up falling apart. You're like, oh, I've never heard that before, or I don't know how to how to
5:55 answer that. And there's a lot of, like, you know, what we would call is just these broad stroke statements that individuals make about concepts and ideas. I and and we have some videos that that
6:07 I wanna interact with and us to engage with to give you an example of how people fragrant flagrantly use the Bible. They flagrantly use a scripture or
6:19 a story in the Bible and make no reference to it, make no connection to it biblically. It's just they say the statement. And then for individuals, the Bible talks about itching
6:30 ears that for individuals who want that statement to be true or like the idea of people saying things that are contrary to common conception, then they'll be like, oh, I like that. I'm
6:42 gonna hold to that. You know, I'm gonna believe that without doing the work themselves. Like, I wonder what biblical passage they're talking about or I wonder, you know, if what they're saying is true in the
6:54 Bible. 1 of the things people will say oftentimes, like I may interact with someone, they'll say, hey, you know, this isn't true because of blank. And then I'll say, well, where is that in the Bible? And they're like, I
7:05 don't know. You know, it's like, well, that's a dangerous thing to do to quote God, to quote the word of God, say something about the Bible, not know where it's at. You don't have to have every answer, but not to have an
7:15 idea of where it's at, but also not have ever read it yourself. And so the first video I have is example of a man who's very well known. He's an agent. I think Scooter Braun was, like, Justin Bieber's
7:27 agent or something like that, and he was in a podcast interview. You know, clip got millions of views. Podcast got pop podcast is a highly viewed podcast, and he teaches the Bible to
7:39 the interview host. And this is the danger of not reading the Bible for yourself because this video had, you know, tens of thousands of likes. And it's amazing
7:51 how we engage with things that it's 1 thing if someone doesn't believe the Bible to be true. It's another thing when someone says, oh, did you know this about God or this about Jesus or or about this story? And it's not
8:02 even the Bible. And so I want you to see what this first clip says, and then we'll talk about it more.
8:08 People think Moses parted the Red Sea. Moses didn't part the Red Sea.
8:12 Pharaoh? Nope.
8:14 So the real story I'm gonna go biblical on you. Okay. The real story is the Egyptians were coming, and they're going to kill everybody, and everyone's freaking
8:25 out. And Aaron and Moses are standing up there saying, god says trust him. Go into the sea. And the sea is, like, choppy as hell. The current's crazy. Like, people go in, you're gonna die. And they're like, Moses
8:37 wants us to commit suicide. Like, this is we're not doing that. And Aaron's brother-in-law, his name was Nachshon. He was the head of the tribe of Judah. He was this regular dude. He was like the leader of his family.
8:48 Something came over him and God said, trust me. And Nachshon, not Moses, walked into the sea and his family started screaming like, don't do this. You're gonna die. And it wasn't until his mouth and his nose went
9:00 under the water that God parted the sea. And it's like 1 of my favorite stories ever of this idea of trust. And in life, it's not until you go into a place that is
9:11 unreasonable, into a place of danger that shows up. And I love that story because that's, like, 1 of the greatest gifts. It's a cheat code of, like, that's life.
9:23 You know? Like, success and failure live next door to each other. You have to go into the resistance. You have to go into the fear, and it isn't until you put yourself into a place of unreasonable danger that you
9:34 Okay. So, know, he's he he he's making a point. You heard this, Nancy? I know not everyone in the room's got headphones on. Did you you watched it, Nancy? Did you hear it? No? You could
9:46 She's writing the the
9:47 Oh, you were reading the captions? Okay. So, you know, you heard it. You got the premise. He he wants to make a point about going deep or taking a taking a a step of faith in
9:59 before you see the answer. Okay. So in concept, right, first, what I wanna do is evaluate what is the heart of the person saying it. Are they just trying to be anti biblical for a re
10:11 a reason? Are they trying to abuse people by manipulating the Bible or biblical words or stories? What what are what are they trying to say? Right? You have certain false
10:22 religions, whether it be like Mormonism or anything else that they're using the Bible to manipulate to to to make a point of what they're trying to express while also bringing people into a religion. What you
10:34 know, what what what he's doing is what he's trying to do is he he has a point, which is, you know, sometimes you gotta you gotta get deep in that water before you see the answer to to what's happening. And so, okay, in
10:46 theory, is that, you know, is that such a bad thing to say that, hey, before you have the answers, you you need to you need to I I didn't hear him say trust God, but just trust. I would say trust God. I'm like, okay.
10:57 Yeah. I mean, I'm not gonna argue with that. But where's your source material for that? Well, your source material is he's telling the most the story of Moses parting the Red Sea. Here's what here's here's what
11:09 we have to do because there's a lot of people who will see that and will like it and be like, wow. I never heard that part of the Bible story. Man, these pastors in America or in the world, they're not teaching us what's
11:20 really in the Bible, etcetera, etcetera. And then you but here's the beauty about God's word being available to everyone is you can open it. So it's like, you can open up to Exodus
11:32 14. And just to recap you, he said that, Aaron had a brother-in-law who was the head of the tribe of Judah who pushed them
11:44 aside because they didn't have enough faith and just started walking in the water and was like, man, I'm gonna I'm gonna I'm gonna walk under this water to the other side if even if I have to. And then and then when he
11:56 was fully submerged in water, God rescued him and parted the Red Sea. He's like, okay. Wow. That sounds like trust me. If that's in the Bible, we're preaching that. That's powerful. Okay? He had enough
12:07 faith. If I die, I die. Let's move on. Wow. Okay. Great faith. Then we go, okay. Where is that story in the Bible? Because he said, I'm gonna go biblical on you. He didn't say, like, I'm gonna
12:19 go whatever, Quran or whatever on you. He said, I'm gonna go biblical, 1 Bible. Somebody say, well, what about the Old Testament? Maybe he's quoting Judaism. Well, that's the Torah. We we wouldn't use the word Bible.
12:31 Jews don't use the word Bible. We do. Christians use the word Bible. So he said, I'm going biblical on you. So we gotta open the Bible. Matthew 4 or or or Exodus 14 21 says, then
12:42 Moses stretched out his hand over the sea and the Lord caused the sea to go back strong east wind all that night and made the sea into dry land and the waters were divided.
12:55 So the children of Israel went into the midst of the sea on dry ground and the waters were a wall to them on their right and hand on on their left hand. And the Egyptians pursued and went after them in the midst of
13:06 the sea, all Pharaoh's horses, chariots, his horsemen. And then now it came to pass and what you'll see is what happens is is the Israelites get to the other side and then God closes the
13:18 ocean. And so here's immediately, what we would do is, do I see any do I see Aaron's name anywhere in this? No. I don't. Do I see another man's name on
13:30 this that could potentially be Aaron's brother-in-law? No. Do I see any inkling of someone that went into the ocean and got frustrated with Moses and said, I'm gonna take this
13:42 on for myself? The answer is no. So therefore, we take the conclusion and say, this is not in the Bible. So as good of a point as he is trying
13:53 to make, it is not in the Bible. So therefore, it shall not be re referenced. It should not be shared as a, hey. Did you know? Because the reality is for Scooter, what he probably did
14:05 was he probably heard this from someone else. That's not an original thought of his. So he probably heard it from someone else and said, wow. Wow. That blew my mind. Whenever I do a podcast or
14:17 whatever, I'm gonna tell this story, and I'm gonna blow Christians' minds with what's really in the Bible, and it's not. And so we have the
14:28 availability to go, wow. Okay. Great point. Or wow. Never heard that before. Cool. I have a Bible. We all have access to the YouVersion Bible app on our phones, or we all have access to
14:40 a physical Bible. Let me go double check that according to God's word, according to what the Bible says. And the reason why I think it's applicable today is because a lot of people
14:52 often say, you know, Jesus is about this. You know, Jesus says this. Jesus says that. And the question is, where does Jesus say that? Where does Jesus do that?
15:04 You know? And you we will see it very common that in order for people to kind of live however they want, do whatever they want, say whatever they want, or not cause friction with someone, they'll say, you know, you're
15:15 you're not being a good Christian. You're like, why? Well, because Jesus is like this. And you're like, well, where did where do you get that from? Like, well, I heard it 1 time. Well, that's dangerous. That's dangerous
15:26 to say, I heard it 1 time. If someone said, you know what? I heard that you can jump off a cliff and you don't need a parachute. And then the next person goes, hey. You know you could jump off that cliff without
15:38 a parachute? And they say, why? He said, well, someone told me that's possible. I'm not trusting that. Like, I'm not believing that. You show me. You jump off that cliff and you show me that you could land
15:50 on the ground without a parachute. You're not. And so this concept of people saying often, did you know Jesus said? Or why are you acting like this when Jesus like this? Or the Bible's like this. Or, you
16:01 know, what you know, God hates people because he killed people in the Old Testament. You ask the question, why were peep why did people die in the Old Testament? I don't know. But I I don't like that anyone died in the
16:12 Old Testament. Like, okay. See, so you haven't even you haven't even read it for yourself. You haven't studied it for yourself. You just like it because it validates an emotion of yours, a thing of yours. And so and so
16:23 we consistently will speak on behalf of the Bible, speak on behalf of Jesus without any true reference of Scripture. I have another example for
16:35 us just to go continue. I got 3 for us today just to continually drill in this idea of the critical nature of studying the Bible for ourselves or looking into it
16:47 ourselves. You may not be at an understanding of the Bible where you feel like you could sit there and study every element. I mean, you will be so encouraged if you move to that path. But just in general, like, when you
16:59 hear things, like, reference them, study them, especially if you're gonna requote it. You're gonna go quote it to your friend as a way to encourage them or you're gonna go go create an argument with someone
17:10 because you heard something that's gonna help your belief better. Like, please make sure that you read it for yourself in the Bible before you go say, well, you know, Jesus says this. And it's like,
17:22 no no, he didn't. You know? He never said what you say he said in the Bible. So you got another book you're referring to because I I don't know where that's coming from. So
17:33 Before he goes on, what about if people are like, well, what about commentary? Is there is it possible that you can find extra history on, like, commentary books? How do you approach that?
17:45 Yeah. For sure. And this next clip, you'll see someone try to reference it. And so commentaries are important. They're very good because a commentary can help you understand a particular
17:57 text more importantly. And here's the you know, we we we can do a shout out for it. No problem. We're we actually did a course curriculum at our church that me and some of our team
18:09 taught on how to read the Bible for yourself. So if you wanna study the Bible for yourself and understand what elements that would help you study the Bible, then you can go to
18:20 patria sprints dot com. Hopefully, can remember, put it in the show notes. But if not, it's patria sprints dot com. That's our church, p a t r I a. So not
18:31 patriot, patria, p a t r I a sprints, like a running sprint with an s at the end, sprints dot com. And you're gonna go to all courses and you're gonna go to
18:44 the what do we have it titled, Nancy? It's a how to read
18:46 How to read your Bible.
18:47 It's a how to read your Bible, how to study your Bible, something like that. You're gonna go to the 1 that says how to study your Bible. It's a 5 hour e course that will help you understand how the
18:59 Bible is set up, you know, 66 books, how many are in the New Testament, how many in the Old Testament, what's the difference between different books from each other. Some are historical, some are poetic,
19:11 some are historical. And so we'll teach you what those are, but then also we'll teach you how to how to study it, how to read it better, which commentaries is 1 of them. And so 1 of the frameworks we wanna do when we're
19:23 reading a comment commentary is, number 1, where is this person within Christianity? Are they part of a historical Christian denomination?
19:34 What has their commentary consistent for the most part with church history? And then on top of that is in church history, what did their peers think of
19:46 that idea? Because someone may say, you're gonna see the next woman. She's gonna say, there are church historians who believe what I just said. That may be true, but those church historians, the people
19:58 that lived with them during those days considered them heretics, you know, considered them them teaching falsely. And so that's like that's like someone in
20:09 1000 years referring to the Scooter Braun clip and saying, you know, there was someone in church history who believed that Aaron had a brother-in-law who he went into the ocean first. And then you have to ask the
20:21 question, well, what did other pastors and theologians think of his statement in his day?
20:26 I see.
20:27 We all think it's we all think it's bogus. So it's like, okay. Well, then, you know, the spirit of God speaks through unity and speaks through the majority. You know? And so
20:39 what happens is with these theological concepts is there's the there's minor things that may have difference across the church. But then you look at the major things. Did Jesus die for our sins? 90 percent
20:51 of churches in the world are gonna say yes. They Jesus died for our sins. Did he resurrect from the grave? 90 percent are gonna say yes. So just because you can find 1 person or 10 per people in church
21:02 history for past 2000 years that say, well, Jesus didn't raise from the grave and like, oh, see, there's people there in his it's like, well, no 1 agreed with them in their day. So that just because you can find that
21:13 statement doesn't mean it's valuable, doesn't mean it's correct. And so you wanna you wanna you wanna do what like, anyone who's been in academia before, like master's program, you want you want peer what we you would
21:25 call peer review criticisms. Right? So let's say let's say a scientist comes out with kind of a new, like, concept. Right? Let's just say what's popular right now.
21:37 Right? Some people are saying there's a connection between, you know, like Tylenol and being on the spectrum. Right? I haven't done any research on anything. But 1 of the questions you wanna ask if that's true is what do
21:48 the peer review say? What what are are there any other doctors studying this connection? Are there any other scientists who can agree with it? And then the moment you see that there's enough scientists that are
22:00 saying, yes, that's true, enough other studies that are saying, yes, this is viable, then you go, okay. There's peer review criticism that agrees with it. And so within theology, you wanna look
22:12 for that same thing is when you're studying something that may quote unquote sound true. Right? You have, like, the Mormonism that says Jesus is the brother of Satan and, you know, and, you
22:24 know, basically, it's a sibling rivalry and all that stuff like that. Number 1, you're gonna go, okay. Is it in the Bible? It's not. Okay? But anyways, number 2, you're gonna go, alright. Is there anyone in church
22:34 history in a majority peer review that it taught about it? No. Not really. So then you have Joseph Smith who says it. He's basically 1 of the first people to ever bring these concepts around. And you go,
22:46 okay. Well, then it's false because, you know, 1800 years of Christianity, no 1 taught this. No no 1 well, there was 1 guy in a cave in the, you know, in whatever. You know? And it's
22:58 like, okay. Well, that that that still, that doesn't that doesn't matter. That's 1 person. You know? There's always you know, broken clocks write twice a day. So just because you go find 1 or 2 things that are you know,
23:08 or people that have said something, that that that doesn't make it true. Just like you could find a handful of people that, you know, believe other things. And it's like, okay. Well, just because you believe it doesn't
23:19 make it true. Right? So first first, our authority is always God's word and commentaries help illuminate God's word deeper for us as we try to understand it. But the higher you
23:31 would go, like for me, went to bible school and stuff, like, can study and I can go to source criticisms and I can and then I can make a decision based off of through the study, especially if it's in the
23:42 scripture, but it's kind of we're we're kind of split, you know, like, you know, the church is split on, you know, whether, you know, women can preach or whatever. And and so you then you you look and you go, okay. Okay.
23:54 Well, there's teaching in history that women taught. They held church and they, you know, shared God's word historically and all these things like that. Is there a minority of it? Yeah. But still, like, there's a history
24:05 of it. There's okay. So now I can make a judgment call that may differ from someone else, but we both have we both done our due diligence to come to a decision that we disagree on that subject. Right?
24:17 And then but bring in a topic like, you know, Moses had a brother, their brother-in-law that went under what is like none of us are. Even us who would disagree, you know, on the
24:29 level of women in ministry, you know, I agree they can be in ministry and they can teach the word and all that. It's like person may say no, but then you bring in someone that's like, you know Aaron had a brother-in-law
24:38 that went under work. We're all like, no. Get out of here. That's not true. Or you know Lucifer was the brother of Jesus. Like, hey, man. Get out of here. No. That's like, we all agree on that. So that's how you kinda
24:46 start defining what's true false teaching and then what's what's, you know, what's, you know, disagreeing on what we would say is a gray area. Right? And so this next clip is kind
24:58 of an example of what we would say is complete false teaching with no rootedness in scripture. Why did Jesus have to die?
25:07 These questions are gonna get me in so much trouble on the Internet, y'all. Short answer, he didn't have to die. The listen. Okay. Don't know how I can distill this into,
25:19 like, something short and reasonable. The the normal evangelical reason for why Jesus had to die is that we're all horrible sinners and God can't look at us. Jesus had to take the punishment for our sin, what
25:31 we deserved, so that we could then have this relationship with God. That is called substitute penal substitutionary atonement. Evangelicalism likes to die on this hill.
25:42 Literally.
25:43 Literally. It is their Golgotha. Like, this is how it has been. This is how it always has been. This is what everyone believes, and it's simply not true. There are many others atonement theories. And if you study any
25:55 part of church history outside of evangelicalism in the United States, you will find them.
26:01 Okay. So, I mean, there's a there's a lot of issues with that statement. But again, someone will see that. You know, this video has some likes. It obviously has more
26:13 shares and all that because it's it's a fringe it's a fringe theology. It's it's a theology that we would say is is a false theology. If she believes that to be true, we we would say is on
26:25 top of that heresy, which is the furthest degree of false accusations of of scripture that that that there can be. And
26:36 so there's a few things just right off the bat that we can immediately kind of show that is like that would be false in
26:48 what she's saying. So you may not be an expert on the Bible. She talked about penal substitution, which is penal substitution is taking the place, substitutionary atonement, which is
27:01 it's about as simple as it sounds. Right? It's a substitute. It's it's let's say I drop something and I break something and I have to clean it up and Nancy or Phil comes here and says and says,
27:14 hey. Let me clean it up for you. They have substituted what I need to do to clean it up. They're not leaving the mess. They're not saying, hey. Just leave it there for the next 20 years. We're gonna see a piece of broken
27:25 glass, and we're gonna see dirt and mold build up because none of us wanted to clean it up. That wouldn't be substitutionary atonement. It would be the fact that I know that I knocked over a jar. I made the mess. I
27:37 know I gotta clean up the mess. But then someone steps in and they say, hey. Let me let me let me let me do the work for you. Let let let me clean it up for you. Let let let let me do the
27:49 dirty work, the painful work to do that. Right? And so this woman is saying, this is not necessary. This wouldn't have been necessary. Jesus didn't need to die. They they they killed him with
28:01 no need that that he coulda he coulda lived a long, happy life and still bought brought everybody freedom, still did everything he needed to do. And the reality is is I don't even know
28:13 what a relationship with Jesus would be beneficial in the sense of what she's trying to say in that sense. But there's a couple things just right off the back that would show us that this is a false teaching.
28:25 Number 1, she said this is only popular popular in evangelicalism. So if you don't know what evangelicalism, that's like what I am. It's I'm I'm a Protestant Christian, so I'm not Catholic.
28:37 I'm not an Orthodox Christian. And so I'm a Protestant modern Christian. And so I'm an evangelical Christian, which which believes that we need to share the gospel of Jesus. It's
28:49 an evangelical. We go and evangelize, which is like what Beyond the Letter is, Beyond I do. It's our it's it's the need and desire to express the message of God to individuals to make an invitation to make
29:01 Jesus their savior. So she said outside of the evangelical church, this is unique to them. They believe that Jesus needed to die and die for their sins and this
29:13 bloody death that God the father allowed his son to die. That is a evangelical Protestant thing. Well, first, like I said with Nancy, first we ask. Protestantism
29:25 is about a little over 500 years old now, came from Catholicism. So, yeah, Martin Luther, John Calvin, Orwig Zwingli, all the all the OG forefathers that came and developed modern
29:37 day Protestantism. And, know, and you got Jonathan Wesley and all these guys that came up through the ranks and established modern Protestantism. And then you have evangelicalism. That would be a few hundred years old,
29:48 which is just the way that we express our faith. So she's saying, oh, you go outside of evangelicalism. You know, this is not really a thing anymore, and there's other things. Well, you go
30:00 outside of evangelicalism and Protestantism, what do you have immediately? You have Catholicism. Does Catholicism believe in penal substitution? Yes. There's like over 1000000000
30:11 Catholics in the world. They believe that Christ died for our sins. I mean, literally every week, they take the Eucharist that confesses that Jesus Christ died for our sins and needed to
30:23 die for our sins. So the Catholics believe that. Then you have okay. What what other major denominations we have? Have the Orthodox denominations. That's Russian
30:35 Orthodox, Greek Orthodox, Ethiopian Orthodox, Coptic Orthodox. What do they believe? They believe that Jesus Christ had to die for our sins and resurrect, and they also
30:47 believe in resurrection. And so, you know, okay. All the major, what we would say, majority and historical church denominations all
30:59 believe in penal substitution. So what is she talking about? You know, that's where I said, like, you have to look at source criticisms. You have to look at like, there's a lot of stuff I don't agree with with Catholics.
31:11 There's things I don't agree with with Orthodox. But we all agree that Jesus needed to die for our sins, that we are sinful, and that Christ forgiveness happens through his
31:23 death, burial, and resurrection. And so you have someone that says, this is an evangelical thing. No, it's not an evangelical thing. It's an evangelical thing because it's a Christian
31:34 thing. That that is what it is. It is not uniquely evangelical. What might be uniquely evangelical is the modernization of sharing our faith, you know, because
31:46 evangelicals, we share our faith through television, you know, radio, podcasting like this. And then all other denominations, they don't really put a high priority on what we would say evangelism. You know, evangelicals
31:58 believe in, you know, sharing their faith with their neighbor. Whereas kind of the others denominations go, okay, well, as I live my life, people may ask me questions and then I will tell them about God. Or through
32:10 my family and raising my children, I teach them about Jesus and that's what makes them Catholic or whatever, where evangelicals are like, oh, no. We gotta we gotta take the great commission serious. We gotta go out into
32:21 the highways and the byways. We gotta go Judea, Samaria, and all the parts of world. We gotta talk about. That's a little uniquely evangelical. But even still, everyone else agrees with we gotta share our faith. So it's
32:31 like there's really nothing too uniquely evangelical. So her just that statement alone, it's almost like she's trying to bid to her audience, like, they're the minority that
32:43 they believe that Jesus died. Like, they're the ones like, they're the ones who have it wrong. The rest of Christianity, once you leave evangelicalism and anyone who doesn't do their research, they just go, oh, wow.
32:55 She sounds smart. She sounds like she's done her homework. And I bet you everything. We I we've we've looked at 1 of her videos before. She's probably got 3 degrees after her name. You know? Like so she's not uneducated.
33:07 I'm sure she's been to seminary. I'm sure she's got a master's in of divinity or some sort of thing. And just because you have that, then doesn't mean you're right. And so they're assuming, oh, is it you know, you know,
33:19 the guy's asking her the q and a. So clearly, she is a person that they're they're, you know, propagating to the people and to online. She has done her research. She has
33:30 evaluated the scripture. She knows church history. And the reality is she is what we would say. And if you take our Bible course, you'll learn it. She's doing what we would say is eisegesis. So you have
33:42 exegesis and you have eisegesis. Exegesis is you study the Bible, you find out what it says, and you pull out the meaning of it. The meaning is in there. It's our job to discover
33:54 the meaning. It's almost as if you and I were archaeologists, and it's just our job to dig up
33:59 the
33:59 dirt, find the bones, clean them off, and figure out what animal does these bones go to. That's that's exegeting. Then you have isegeting, which would be like, I pull a bone out
34:11 of my pocket that I took from home because I had chicken dinner, and I pull out a chicken leg, and then I make a hole in the dirt. I put the chicken leg in there. I close it, and then I go and I dig it up
34:23 with somebody and I go, oh, wow. Look. Look at this. This looks like a dinosaur bone. You know? It's like it's I put into it what I wanted, and then now even I'm redefining what it really is
34:35 to make sense for me of what I'm trying to accomplish. And so what this individual is trying to do because the moment you acknowledge that Christ had to die, you have to ask the question, well, why? What
34:47 for? And then you have to answer for your sins. And then you have to define what sin is. Then you have to define what missing the mark is. Then you have to define what being dirty before God means because
34:59 He's holy. And for her, she's in what you would you would kind of fit more progressive. And so she doesn't want to address sin. She doesn't want to talk about sin. She doesn't want to define sin. So the moment she saysShow more
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